Buying an alphard - advice

[Kerryn]

Hi all

 

I am looking to buy an alphard to then convert into a camper. This one is fairly local to me so I am going to have a look:

 

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202310022576807?sort=price-asc&advertising-location=at_cars&include-delivery-option=on&make=Toyota&model=Alphard&page=3&postcode=rg402ad&fromsra

 

The reg is bw07tsy

 

I have two questions:

 

It was imported in July and is now up for sale again which seems a bit strange. Does anyone on here know anything about it?

 

At its last mot it had a oil leek as a advisory, is this common on the 3.0 and is it anything to worry about?

 

Any comments are really appreciated.

 

[Rojie]

1 hour ago, Kerryn said:

Hi all

 

I am looking to buy an alphard to then convert into a camper. This one is fairly local to me so I am going to have a look:

 

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202310022576807?sort=price-asc&advertising-location=at_cars&include-delivery-option=on&make=Toyota&model=Alphard&page=3&postcode=rg402ad&fromsra

 

The reg is bw07tsy

 

I have two questions:

 

It was imported in July and is now up for sale again which seems a bit strange. Does anyone on here know anything about it?

 

At its last mot it had a oil leek as a advisory, is this common on the 3.0 and is it anything to worry about?

 

Any comments are really appreciated.

 

 

Hello Kerryn,

 

Welcome to the Forum.

 

You could check the MOT History on the DVLA website.

 

It would appear some upcoming maintenance will be necessary.

Will all that work be completed prior to sale ?

[Kerryn]

Thanks for your response 👍

 

They have an on site mot station and promise an advisory free mot. So they will do all of that assuming it hasn't been done already.

 

Oil leaks can be difficult to sort out on some cars hence why I am worried mainly about.

 

I don't spend the same again on a conversion to then find it's got an incurable oil leak or a damaged engine further down the line!

[Lanciaman]

I'd be wary. Second photo looks like the rear door doesn't match paint wise... Missing button on the dash. OK, that's minor but if its representative of the care taken... 

 

No expert on camper conversions but I think i've read sunroof cars not ideal? Could be wrong. 

 

If local then have a look but any reservations then there's plenty out there.  An alphard specialist would be a better bet in my view. 

 

Best of luck. 

[dezufo]

The 3.0L are not known for oil leaks, it could be a perished rocker cover gasket or a leak elsewhere, it would need to be upon a ramp so an inspection of the underneath of the engine could be carried out

[Rojie]

14 minutes ago, Lanciaman said:

I'd be wary. Second photo looks like the rear door doesn't match paint wise... Missing button on the dash. OK, that's minor but if its representative of the care taken... 

 

No expert on camper conversions but I think i've read sunroof cars not ideal? Could be wrong. 

 

If local then have a look but any reservations then there's plenty out there.  An alphard specialist would be a better bet in my view. 

 

Best of luck. 

 

I didn't look at the website !

 

Lyndsey is correct. Alphies with the sunroof and moonroof combination are not ideal for pop top conversions, if that is what you had in mind.

But they are OK for side and rear conversions.

 

I'll check DVLA again. Wasn't the oil leak in the suspension ?

Not the engine gearbox combination ?

 

It does say front of the engine ! Sorry

 

[Rojie]

9 minutes ago, Rojie said:

 

I didn't look at the website !

 

Lyndsey is correct. Alphies with the sunroof and moonroof combination are not ideal for pop top conversions, if that is what you had in mind.

I could find out why if you need me to.

But they are OK for side and rear conversions.

 

I'll check DVLA again. Wasn't the oil leak in the suspension ?

Not the engine gearbox combination ?

 

It does say front of the engine too ! Sorry

 

 

I agree with Pete.

My V6 is bone dry.

 

Location of leak will make all the difference.

Top or Lower engine.

 

Oil leaks can be an MOT fail.

 

I'll take a look at the website now. Better late than never !

 

Do you have a 4 cylinder atm ? As your profile says you do !

[Kerryn]

Thanks for all responses!

 

The point about sunroofs is a very good one as I will be getting a pop top.

 

I might go and have a look anyway but am a bit put off.

 

No not currently an owner, I chose a random one as it insisted on me saying I owned one to sign up! I hopefully will be soon though and will update accordingly.

[Kerryn]

1 hour ago, Lanciaman said:

I'd be wary. Second photo looks like the rear door doesn't match paint wise... Missing button on the dash. OK, that's minor but if its representative of the care taken... 

 

No expert on camper conversions but I think i've read sunroof cars not ideal? Could be wrong. 

 

If local then have a look but any reservations then there's plenty out there.  An alphard specialist would be a better bet in my view. 

 

Best of luck. 

You are absolutely right about the door colour. I thought it was the lighting but picture 27 shows it from another angle and the colour is definitely off.

 

Thank you for pointing it out.

[Torq2u]

I agree about the door colour. Also one of the (seven??) reversing sensors seems to be in a dimple which could indicate accident damage.

 

Surely not seven sensors across the back bumper?

[dezufo]

12 hours ago, Kerryn said:

Thanks for all responses!

 

The point about sunroofs is a very good one as I will be getting a pop top.

 

I might go and have a look anyway but am a bit put off.

 

No not currently an owner, I chose a random one as it insisted on me saying I owned one to sign up! I hopefully will be soon though and will update accordingly.

If you are getting a pop top then the sun/moon roofs are just a waste of money. I notice that Torqu2u picked up on 7 sensors in the back bumper, they only come with 5 sensors so 2 of them have been retro fitted and not very well as they are larger than oem and the bumper looks dimpled. The mot says "front oil leak" but does not mention if it's on the engine, transmission cooler/pipes/, or power steering. The site gives no info on what the "huge specification" is. The speedo is still in kmh so that will involve paying for either a converter chip or a replacement mph dial if you want to make it easy to stick to uk speed limits. As it's a 3.0l the cam belt will need replacing if only due to its age rather than the kilometers traveled. There is no obvious rear fog light, although it could have the ones in the bumper, and no fog light switch, a switch or blank is missing on the dash and another blank has had a small led fitted and then removed leaving a hole. If you think it might be worth getting then get the vin number off the dealer and do a CarVX check, cost approx £25, that will give the odometer reading at the auction and also if it has been in an accident, also the auction grade. Another iffy point is the on site mot testing

[Kerryn]

2 hours ago, dezufo said:

If you are getting a pop top then the sun/moon roofs are just a waste of money. I notice that Torqu2u picked up on 7 sensors in the back bumper, they only come with 5 sensors so 2 of them have been retro fitted and not very well as they are larger than oem and the bumper looks dimpled. The mot says "front oil leak" but does not mention if it's on the engine, transmission cooler/pipes/, or power steering. The site gives no info on what the "huge specification" is. The speedo is still in kmh so that will involve paying for either a converter chip or a replacement mph dial if you want to make it easy to stick to uk speed limits. As it's a 3.0l the cam belt will need replacing if only due to its age rather than the kilometers traveled. There is no obvious rear fog light, although it could have the ones in the bumper, and no fog light switch, a switch or blank is missing on the dash and another blank has had a small led fitted and then removed leaving a hole. If you think it might be worth getting then get the vin number off the dealer and do a CarVX check, cost approx £25, that will give the odometer reading at the auction and also if it has been in an accident, also the auction grade. Another iffy point is the on site mot testing

Lots of great information there, thank you. I'm not now considering this one but I will definitely factor in the above for any more suitable ones that come up!

 

I do love forums for finding knowledgeable people who are willing share info and helps others. Thanks again all for you help and advice! I will post again if I find any other alphards and will eventually post about the process of getting the one I buy converted.

[stopgapcat]

I think there are probably better examples out there if you are prepared to travel a bit to get the right one. And things like the speedo conversion, rear fog light and under body treatment (they don't use salt on the roads in Japan in told) really ought to have been taken care of before you buy.

[Rojie]

1 hour ago, stopgapcat said:

I think there are probably better examples out there if you are prepared to travel a bit to get the right one. And things like the speedo conversion, rear fog light and under body treatment (they don't use salt on the roads in Japan in told) really ought to have been taken care of before you buy.

 

I agree wholeheartedly with this.

 

AND you should research the cost of conversion too; it may surprise you.

Pop Top installation does not come cheap !

 

It may be more economically, and less risky, to buy ready converted.

[Geralt]

I think you're right to be cautious. Ditto everybody else and those A/C buttons look more worn that I'd expect for 60,000 miles.

 

[Rojie]

2 hours ago, Kerryn said:

Lots of great information there, thank you. I'm not now considering this one but I will definitely factor in the above for any more suitable ones that come up!

 

I do love forums for finding knowledgeable people who are willing share info and helps others. Thanks again all for you help and advice! I will post again if I find any other alphards and will eventually post about the process of getting the one I buy converted.

 

I think you have made a wise decision.

I did not want to list all my observations, as it would be so depressing.

 

Anyone notice the tail gate bottom edge has a foot long (at least) deformation.

 

The vehicle has not been well cared for.

[Kerryn]

16 hours ago, Rojie said:

 

I think you have made a wise decision.

I did not want to list all my observations, as it would be so depressing.

 

Anyone notice the tail gate bottom edge has a foot long (at least) deformation.

 

The vehicle has not been well cared for.

Now you've said it yes, the rear is a mess!

[Kerryn]

19 hours ago, Rojie said:

 

I agree wholeheartedly with this.

 

AND you should research the cost of conversion too; it may surprise you.

Pop Top installation does not come cheap !

 

It may be more economically, and less risky, to buy ready converted.

We were originally going to buy an already converted one but that was going be £23k plus. 

 

We want a rear kitchen which is a bit cheaper so the whole conversion will come in at about £8k. That gives us a good budget for a base car so we should be able to get a really good, low miles example.

 

The temptation with this one was that it was near and available. I am really excited to get one as soon as possible so was rushing a bit!

Edited October 28, 2023 by Kerryn

[Rojie]

2 hours ago, Kerryn said:

We were originally going to buy an already converted one but that was going be £23k plus. 

 

We want a rear kitchen which is a bit cheaper so the whole conversion will come in at about £8k. That gives us a good budget for a base car so we should be able to get a really good, low miles example.

 

The temptation with this one was that it was near and available. I am really excited to get one as soon as possible to was rushing a bit!

 

I think you are back on the right track, pun intended.

You should be able to find a rear conversion for much less than 23k.

If you buy commercially the vendor must charge you 20% VAT.

If they are not VAT registered be wary.

So almost 4k to the Tax Man !

That sum will not be, realistically, recoverable.

 

A PopTop is likely to cost you 50% (at least) of your conversion budget.

I have a top quality rear conversion which ran to 4k approx; but VAT was not payable.

 

I think your budget is quite reasonable; just don't get carried away.

 

Unfortunately, as with everything nowadays, prices can be silly.

 

You will find, buried within the Forum, recommendations for most of the Top 10 converters.

Perhaps a call to enquire about trade-ins may be fruitful, albeit with the dreaded VAT.

 

I can wholeheartedly recommend a professional convertor that did my conversion.

He is a small business, and not required to be VAT registered, and has a lot of experience fitting poptops.

I do not have a poptop, but have witnessed his work with poptops on several occasions.

 

Downside, he is close to my location, hence not yours !

 

Good Luck on your quest to join the ranks of Alphard Campers.

 

Happy Camparding !

[Kerryn]

Thanks for the input Rojie.

 

23k is to have one imported and then converted to our spec which is obviously going to be top money.

 

The problem with getting one already converted is with wanting a rear kitchen and 3.0 there are very few we would be interested in.

 

I have been in contact with Northstar. They haven't given an exact quote yet but it looks to be comfortably less than 9k which brings it all in at a price I would be happy with. I am also excited at the prospect of having it taylor converted.

 

It will be my main car and we will hopefully use it lots for 8 plus years so I need to make sure I make the right decisions now!

[pipsyp]

I have a 2008 converted 2.4.

 

Has a rear kitchen, factory 2nd row (so essentially it's still a factory 5 seater) which converts into a flat sleeping space and also has a drivelodge pop top.

 

I can tell you mine is a sunroof car, from a conversion perspective it doesn't really matter, all it will mean is you won't have the sunroofs anymore but will still have the switches for them.  My vehicle was imported mid 2021 by Stuart Spencer Autos for the people I purchased it from and then the conversion was managed by them before collection (New Dawn did the kitchen and electrics, Northstar the pop top conversion).  People who have been converting these for a long time don't care if they have the sunroofs, just they are a bit more straightforward to convert without.

 

The Drivelodge is pretty good, looks neat and you can hardly tell it's there when driving it.  Of the poptops available, it's probably one of the better designed/developed units.  Not cheap though (mine cost c.4k to do).

 

If I can offer any advise.......

 

Don't discount the 2.4.  People on here do tend to preference the V6 and I do get why, but even unconverted this isn't a performance vehicle (they drive well but the steering is very slow and dim witted and it's definitely designed to drive well in a straight line!) and the 160hp 2.4 will haul you around quite admirably and actually still has a relatively decent lick of pace if you use the gears and rev it.  It's not fast by any stretch, but it will sit on a motorway as speed quite happily and is a pleasure to drive.  I am also a bit of a petrolhead and like/have had some fairly quick cars.  MPG wise there probably isn't much in it but note the 2.4 runs quite happily on E10 as well and whilst it probably has to work a bit harder it will still do 28/29 mpg on a sensible long run.  It also has a timing chain, so no cambelt changes to worry about.  The V6 is a non interference engine so if the belt did go, you won't bend valves but they still need a cambelt change every so often.

 

Possibly avoid the Hybrid.  They aren't at all bad, not at all but they are considerably more complicated in the same way an early Prius is compared to a regular car or a similar age.  Short version, the regular 2.4 and V6 are easier to fix if they go wrong.

 

Think about how you want to have it converted.  Everyone has their own view on this, but whilst I didn't get to choose how mine was converted, I think side conversions are more compromised.  Firstly you lose access to one or the sidedoors.  Also you end up having to trade the factory 3 seat 2nd row for a 3rd party made rock and roll bed.  These may be more comfortable to sleep on, but if you are going to be carrying passengers in it regularly, they aren't very nice to sit in.  With mine, it still serves a purpose as a 2nd family car, also the space behind the rear seats serves as quite a roomy boot space, so it's not a great deal less practical for having the kitchen in the rear (just has to be loaded through the side doors, not the boot).

 

I'll be honest, I got mine for a relative steal and it's undoubtedly worth a fair bit than I paid for it (looks like most are 20k+ from reputable places) but if you are going to the trouble of converting one, source the right vehicle first through a well regarded importer and get them to assist with the conversion.  Perhaps give Stuart Spencer Autos a look?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited October 28, 2023 by pipsyp

[pipsyp]

Ooooh another point....Insurance.

 

These things aren't the cheapest to insure anyway.  Converted it's definitely more of a challenge.  Less companies are interested in covering them and many that will want quite a premium.  You may find you end up having to go with someone that specialises in camper van conversions to get a more reasonable premium.

[Kerryn]

Thanks pipsyp, some really useful thoughts there.

 

I am fairly set on the 3.0 just as I've always wanted v6 of some sort so it ticks that box. It will be replacing a civic type r so similar running costs to that.

 

I completely agree on the rear kitchen. We've been talking about campers seen may but just didn't like the layout most of them have. We have 2 small kids and do kayaking and bike riding lots and we couldn't imagine fitting all the stuff in for a short holiday. When we saw the rear kitchen layout we knew that was for us. We have been and sat in one so we know it will fit us well.

 

Drivelodge I will look into, I haven't really got into details yet but will bear that in mind.

 

You are absolutely right, getting a good vehicle is really important and I need to hold out.

 

I may well give Stuart Spencer try as that's not too far from me.

 

Thanks again!

[pipsyp]

1 hour ago, Kerryn said:

Thanks pipsyp, some really useful thoughts there.

 

I am fairly set on the 3.0 just as I've always wanted v6 of some sort so it ticks that box. It will be replacing a civic type r so similar running costs to that.

 

I completely agree on the rear kitchen. We've been talking about campers seen may but just didn't like the layout most of them have. We have 2 small kids and do kayaking and bike riding lots and we couldn't imagine fitting all the stuff in for a short holiday. When we saw the rear kitchen layout we knew that was for us. We have been and sat in one so we know it will fit us well.

 

Drivelodge I will look into, I haven't really got into details yet but will bear that in mind.

 

You are absolutely right, getting a good vehicle is really important and I need to hold out.

 

I may well give Stuart Spencer try as that's not too far from me.

 

Thanks again!

No worries Kerryn!

 

Totally get it RE the V6, I happened across mine and was an opportunistic (to good to turn down) purchase....it was a 2.4 so had no choice in the matter really but I would also preference the V6 if I was actually going out to buy one from scratch.  That said I like the 2.4 and haven't been at all disappointed by it, other than being a bit thirsty A to B.  People say the 2.4 is underpowered, it really isn't.

 

Look out for an MS I would.  There are four main variants AX (2.4 non sport), AS (2.4 sport), MX (3.0 non sport) and MS (3.0 sport).  The 'S' variants have a nice bodykit and boot spoiler on them and IMHO definitely look better than the regular car, though that's subjective.  A number of different specifications as well, no two Alphards seem to be the same!

 

Look out for examples with power doors and tailgates.  Some have none, some have one power door, some have two power doors, some have two power doors and a power tailgate.  I have power doors and tailgate and find them pretty useful, though it is something else to break/fail.

 

I wouldn't bother with a car with the sonar parking system unless it's otherwise a good car.  They don't function quite like parking sensor systems we are used to nowadays, I gather you have to get very close to something then an angry Japanese voice shouts at you instead of bleeping.  Retrofitting some sensors is probably the way to go if you want them, but they are quite square so not too challenging to park.  The thing also beeps relentlessly at you when reversing anyway (it's a JDM thing) so how well you'd hear sensors over that I don't know!

 

The factory nav head unit is a bit random as it's mostly in Japanese and have CD and Mini Disc players.  Also unless a band expander has been fitted the radio won't work.  Its possible to fit a aftermarket double din and make it work with the factory rear camera (if fitted) and steering wheel controls, but the fascia adaptor and working for the camera and controls can be quite costly.  Mine came already fitted with an expensive Pioneer double DIN with DAB, Bluetooth and wireless carplay/android auto and and integrated to my factory rear camera and steering wheel controls so got lucky there!  Many have a TV in the back and I believe you tend to lose that if you remove the factory audio, but you would have to lose it with a poptop conversion anyway.

 

They pretty much all have adaptive (by this I believe this is just auto levelling) xenon headlamps and folding mirrors, just a good idea to make sure they are all working as both can be a bit of a pain to fix if they have a problem.  If you have a flashing AFS Off light in the cluster the auto levelling for the Xenons is up the spout.  You can fix folding mirror motors but it's not that straightforward.

 

RE the Drivelodge top, if you opt for one with opening side windows be aware that the flynets fitted to them can be a bit of a weak point.  Mine split badly at barely two years old so I had them removed.....it's actually better without them IMHO.  Drivelodge said that it was most likely that they had been cleaned with something which led to the mesh deteriorating but I think that's unlikely (just split from being folded more than it's open I suspect).  Also, I have the LED rooflights in mine and have found they haven't ever worked, though I suspect it's a wiring issue, not a problem with the LEDs themselves.  Otherwise I think they are a really good bit of kit.  Just make sure it gets fitted by a Drivelodge approved installer (if I had the choice, I would have used Drivelodge themselves most likely).

 

Feel free to PM me if there's anything else you want to know/ask, is no problem!

 

 

 

Edited October 28, 2023 by pipsyp

[Kerryn]

So much info, thank you!

 

Yes the amount they vary from one to another seems to be huge and it doesn't seem to tally with the models all that much, I have found it very confusing. The power doors is definitely something I want but I thought they all had that so really useful to know that's something to look out for.

 

As for the head unit I will hopefully get that changed if it hasn't been done already. There is a place near me that I believe can sort that.

 

Poptops I am in conversation with northstar at the moment, I will see what they recommend. I definitely want lighting in it as it will be used as a bedroom.

 

My next step now is to wait for a decent one to come up. If that does happen I will try contacting some importers. The above is really useful to check the car over to make sure it's what I want.

 

Hopefully I will have one by spring so we can start using it!