Rear Foglights - better integration

[The Flower Man]

7 hours ago, arthurj said:

Hmm. Just checked the rules here 2021 guidelines and it says

 

It's a major fault if any other lamp interferes with the fog lamp and I assume the reversing lamp counts

 

Though maybe a straight-up replacement is fine, so there's only one fog and one reverse light.

one fog lamp and one reverse lamp is all that is required for an mot. i am thinking of loosing a reverse lamp and putting a red led bulb in its place.

All the light lenses on the back of my Alphard are white anyway. we know this is fine in an mot because if you have a high level brake light in the spoiler at the back of your Alphard, you will find it has a clear lens from the factory fit.

It is interesting what you say about the fog light not interfering with other lighting systems. Technically it wouldn't. as you have explained it, the reverse light is overriding the fog light and not the other way round. I am sure there is no requirement to have an operating fog light while reversing 🙃

The operation of a reverse light has to happen via the gear selecter which it will. i cant see why it would fail going buy the mot guide lines.

Its all open to interpretation but a fog lamp can be independantly wired to the rest of the car so it may say "interfering" because of bad wiring using power from another light and dimming it or sharing an earth that dims everything.

[starider]

Hi,back again ref. reflectors, there seems to be a lot of ideas regarding fog lights/reflectors. My preference is a pair of fogs as described earlier and as in my case 4 reflectors,two as fitted as standard and one on each mudflap, why? because should my lights fail or I'm parked without lights, I want my Alphard to light up like a Christmas tree!. I hope everyone finishes up with rear reflectors and rear fogs that they are happy with.

[Rojie]

1 hour ago, starider said:

Hi, back again ref. reflectors, there seems to be a lot of ideas regarding fog lights/reflectors. My preference is a pair of fogs as described earlier and as in my case 4 reflectors ,two as fitted as standard and one on each mudflap, why? because should my lights fail or I'm parked without lights, I want my Alphard to light up like a Christmas tree!. I hope everyone finishes up with rear reflectors and rear fogs that they are happy with.

 

On this topic of reflectors !

I am still active on this.

 

Some members have raised the point about visibility of any reflectors fitted; hence their concern about my minimalistic approach. My Alphie is White, so I am less concerned that I would be it it were Black.

 

I have now received my tiny reflectors which, subject to approval from my MOT guy, I will fit to meet the minimum MOT  requirements. BUT .... And I need to read the regulations again, and consult with my MOT guy. IF satisfactory reflectors ARE fitted that meet the dimensional requirements, there does not appear to be any dimensional requirements on any  additional reflectors !

 

If true, interesting. If not true, unhelpful.

 

It is such a shame that those RDN units appear to be non reflective !!

 

[starider]

Hi Rojie,

I have the problem with the all- in- one rear light clusters on my wife's Connect van, the clear plastic rev. light lens goes opaque after a while and as I've mentioned previously I realised the relector lens did not reflect. I can only get pattern clusters at a sensible price, even when described as OE which I have realised is not the case.

I think much of the Chinese lighting products are basically good but they do not understand fully UK requirements. It's still cheaper to buy a new lens every couple of years.

Hope your MOT man is happy with the reflectors you have bought. PS My Alphard is also white.

[Rojie]

18 hours ago, starider said:

Hi Rojie,

I have the problem with the all- in- one rear light clusters on my wife's Connect van, the clear plastic rev. light lens goes opaque after a while and as I've mentioned previously I realised the relector lens did not reflect. I can only get pattern clusters at a sensible price, even when described as OE which I have realised is not the case.

I think much of the Chinese lighting products are basically good but they do not understand fully UK requirements. It's still cheaper to buy a new lens every couple of years.

Hope your MOT man is happy with the reflectors you have bought. PS My Alphard is also white.

 

I don't think there are any problems with the chinese made rear light units.

No one, as far as I am aware, has yet identified a light unit that includes retroreflective lenses !

 

The light units I have seen are fine if, as you do, have separate reflectors.

Some have rear lights, and brake lights and reversing lights; but not reflectors !

If members are hoping they include reflectors they will almost certainly be disappointed.

 

My new reflectors cost less than £5, so i'll find a use for them somewhere. Maybe my Grandson's bicycle !

[starider]

I have an Ifor Williams double axle plant trailer which I use for moving small classic cars around and the rear is covered in reflectors. I have found over the years,when driving with the trailer at night on Motorways, that many drivers still drive at speeds normally driven in good daylight[or wet roads] and have had near misses with high speed vehicles arriving at speed on something travelling at comparatively lower speed and having to take avoiding action. At least the warning they get is extremely visible!

[Chris.ac]

https://www.jauce.com/auction/k1038214245

https://www.jauce.com/auction/t1010370578

 

These are for 10 series - they both appear to have reflex reflector properties and lighting - one part is a private seller,and the other is available on bulk.

Edited March 7, 2022 by Chris.ac

[Rojie]

2 hours ago, Chris.ac said:

https://www.jauce.com/auction/k1038214245

https://www.jauce.com/auction/t1010370578

 

These are for 10 series - they both appear to have reflex reflector properties and lighting - one part is a private seller, and the other is available on bulk.

 

Hi Chris,

 

Nice to hear from you again.

I have my doubts about these, but if I needed one, I'd go for the first. It's only £20, plus postage!

[starider]

Hi, I agree with Rojie, I'm afraid you will only know for certain if the lens is reflective is if you purchase one/pair. As I mentioned in a previous post, the reflector in the replacement rear lamp assembly I got for our Connect van has a reflector behind the red outer lens, but when a headlamp lights up the rear of the van, the fog lamp lens just looks red no bright reflected light at all.

It would be great if you do take the plunge and they do reflect, it would remove all the speculation.

[Chris.ac]

12 hours ago, starider said:

Hi, I agree with Rojie, I'm afraid you will only know for certain if the lens is reflective is if you purchase one/pair. As I mentioned in a previous post, the reflector in the replacement rear lamp assembly I got for our Connect van has a reflector behind the red outer lens, but when a headlamp lights up the rear of the van, the fog lamp lens just looks red no bright reflected light at all.

It would be great if you do take the plunge and they do reflect, it would remove all the speculation.

I might do, resell it here if it works

[Rojie]

2 hours ago, Chris.ac said:

I might do, resell it here if it works

 

Both Starider and I have facelifted Gen1 though.

I assume the size is different, nice id they are identical sizes.

I need to look at the rear of a Gen 2.

[raoul]

On 12/18/2021 at 5:09 PM, Chris.ac said:

Part number  84140-42080 - common to several high end toyotas, the standard part is 84140-42070 - the wiring loom is already set up for the rear fog, even the fuse was present - I had to add the relay in the passenger side footwell.

 

I bought part from here:

https://www.amayama.com/en/part/toyota/8414042080

 

next step is to drop bumper and connect the fogs to the existing plug that is attached to the driver side rear sonar sensor

Hi, you said you had to add the relay in the passenger side footwell. can you explain that to me? did you have to buy this relay?

[Rojie]

2 hours ago, raoul said:

Hi, you said you had to add the relay in the passenger side footwell. can you explain that to me? did you have to buy this relay?

 

Hi Raoul,

 

Those part numbers appear to be for switch assemblies; not the rear fog light cluster.

[Chris.ac]

Fog relay fuse.pdf

The relay you need is identical to the 'STCut relay' (Same part number) that is in the same relay/fuse block, I got the part number from the Toyota EPC, but my local shops didnt have it by that part number, a mechanic was in the shop at the time, he was able to recognise the relay just from the photo and pin arrangement on that PDF, he had a scrap peugeot on his trailer and gave me one of the relays from that for free, its a common relay type, so should not be hard to find

for info:

https://toyota.epc-data.com/alphard/ggh20w/63376/electric/8401/85916L/

[ThuMentaliss]

Why all of these posts regarding rear fog lights!!

 

Here's my photo of this Topic, twin lights, fused/relay switched via a led rocker switch, fitted within the dash switches, compliments the 'back-side' of the vehicle,  Simple, neat, not fussy

[Rojie]

21 minutes ago, ThuMentaliss said:

Why all of these posts regarding rear fog lights!!

 

Here's my photo of this Topic, twin lights, fused/relay switched via a led rocker switch, fitted within the dash switches, compliments the 'back-side' of the vehicle,  Simple, neat, not fussy

 

Looks great, but some of us wanted those rear reflectors (above your fog lights) but with fog lights within.

 

Most, not necessarily all, do not incorporate reflectors (despite what the ebay or Amazon descriptions say!)

[ThuMentaliss]

3 minutes ago, Rojie said:

 

Looks great, but some of us wanted those rear reflectors (above your fog lights) but with fog lights within.

 

Most, not necessarily all, do not incorporate reflectors (despite what the ebay or Amazon descriptions say!)

Yes I can understand that, to me is the usage factor has also be considered of what your prepared to pay for instance I haven't used my built-in rear fog lights on my Kodiaq since I purchased the vehicle two years ago😎

[Rojie]

24 minutes ago, ThuMentaliss said:

Yes I can understand that, to me is the usage factor has also be considered of what your prepared to pay for instance I haven't used my built-in rear fog lights on my Kodiaq since I purchased the vehicle two years ago😎

 

You are absolutely right.

I cannot remember when I last used any rear fog lights on any of my vehicles.

[Chris.ac]

I use them quite regularly, having to turn them off and on several times on some trips, lots of A303 and M4 commuting.

The installation using the rocker switch means it is obscured by the steering wheel - the proper switch gear means you have the telltale incorporated into the dash clocks properly, and if you forget to switch them off, at the end of a commute, they automatically revert back to the off state the next time you start engine.

 

Its just personal preference, some people like to lower their vehicle and fit 20" wheels, or fit bodykits, for me im a sucker for keeping the external look as close to original as possible.

 

[Rojie]

8 hours ago, Chris.ac said:

I use them quite regularly, having to turn them off and on several times on some trips, lots of A303 and M4 commuting.

The installation using the rocker switch means it is obscured by the steering wheel - the proper switch gear means you have the telltale incorporated into the dash clocks properly, and if you forget to switch them off, at the end of a commute, they automatically revert back to the off state the next time you start engine.

 

Its just personal preference, some people like to lower their vehicle and fit 20" wheels, or fit bodykits, for me im a sucker for keeping the external look as close to original as possible.

 

 

Hi Chris, Yes, I always wanted to keep my camper as a stealth too.

I will check my rear fog lights to ensure they are switched off by the ignition.

Not as good as your new stalk implementation, but I am less confident than you when it comes to mods and upgrades.

If not, I'll look into your method, but mine is a Gen 1 facelift

[ThuMentaliss]

9 hours ago, Chris.ac said:

I use them quite regularly, having to turn them off and on several times on some trips, lots of A303 and M4 commuting.

The installation using the rocker switch means it is obscured by the steering wheel - the proper switch gear means you have the telltale incorporated into the dash clocks properly, and if you forget to switch them off, at the end of a commute, they automatically revert back to the off state the next time you start engine.

 

Its just personal preference, some people like to lower their vehicle and fit 20" wheels, or fit bodykits, for me im a sucker for keeping the external look as close to original as possible.

      __________________________________________________________________________________________________

    If one purchases and installs it the rocker switch correctly with the led illumination pointing upwards, its impossible not to be aware that its on😎

 

 

[Chris.ac]

1 hour ago, ThuMentaliss said:

 

Trust me, I have a switch that is illuminated with all the other buttons, and has a 'on' led on it too, it is not visible from my normal seated postion, I have to crane my neck to see it through the spokes of the steering wheel - the spares slots in my dash are 'keyed' for specific toyota switchgear so you would have to file away plastic to get an aftermarket switch to fit - there is one 'generic' hole that accepts the switch without hacking away at dash. - I had thought to swap positions of some of the installed switches to make more visible, this is how I found out that it was not possible without lots of unnecessary damage

 

 

The original aftermarket switch the dealer fitted was done by drilling a hole next to the start button!, so I ripped that out and replaced that part of the dash because it looked so rubbish.

Edited March 13, 2022 by Chris.ac

[starider]

Is'nt it amazing how one topic stirs up a lot of interest and comment,it only goes to show how useful, interesting and informative these club forums are for owners. Keep up the good work!!

[Rojie]

On 3/13/2022 at 9:49 AM, Rojie said:

 

Hi Chris, Yes, I always wanted to keep my camper as a stealth too.

I will check my rear fog lights to ensure they are switched off by the ignition.

Not as good as your new stalk implementation, but I am less confident than you when it comes to mods and upgrades.

If not, I'll look into your method, but mine is a Gen 1 facelift

 

I finally checked my rear foglights, to ensure the tell tale worked and I could see it from the drivers position.

The switch is visible from the drivers position,

Despite recently passing the MOT the tell tale does not work !

And nor do the fog lights !

I could not believe it.

I need to check as it all it may have just failed; but I don't think so. !!!

 

[Chris.ac]

Well, as mentioned previously - I decided to take one for the team and purchase one of the more expensive reflector solutions.

It definately reflects!!! I used just the light source from my phone and its almost like getting back 90% of the light!

Excuse the sound quality, but I hope you get an idea of the reflective quality of these lenses - I dont have a 12v supply in the house at moment to test the led function!

I placed the cheap ebay 'LED/Reflector' I purchased last year, but didnt fit as it was non-compliant underneath, so you can see the comparison